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Which Bruce Trilogy?

Trying to remember a title or an author? Want to know who or what a particular novel is about? Want a recommendation for books about a particular person or period? Post here!
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Brenna
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Post by Brenna » Sun January 15th, 2012, 11:34 pm

It only took 200 pages, but I'm finally getting into the Nigel trilogy!
Brenna

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Brenna
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Post by Brenna » Tue January 17th, 2012, 1:57 pm

Does anyone know why "must needs" is used constantly when all that is needed is "needs." Is this a Scottish thing or a Tranter thing?
Brenna

Jen Black
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Post by Jen Black » Fri January 27th, 2012, 3:20 pm

Personally I liked Low's Lion Awakes. It isn't the easiest of reads because of the constant headhopping, but as the book progresses, the headhopping lessens. The characters are vivid, the incidents believable and there's a nice flavour of Scots aboutt he dialogue.

Carla
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Post by Carla » Fri January 27th, 2012, 6:08 pm

[quote=""Brenna""]Does anyone know why "must needs" is used constantly when all that is needed is "needs." Is this a Scottish thing or a Tranter thing?[/quote]

I'm not a grammarian, so I may be wrong on this, but since nobody else has replied yet I'll have a go. I think in 'must needs', the word 'needs' is being used as an adverb to add emphasis. The phrase has a slightly archaic sound to me, so maybe Tranter was using it for atmosphere?
PATHS OF EXILE - love, war, honour and betrayal in Anglo-Saxon Northumbria
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MLE (Emily Cotton)
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Interest in HF: started in childhood with the classics, which, IMHO are HF even if they were contemporary when written.
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Preferred HF: Currently prefer 1600 and earlier, but I'll read anything that keeps me turning the page.
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Post by MLE (Emily Cotton) » Fri January 27th, 2012, 6:14 pm

It's a familiar old usage; Shakespeare uses it, but it's more often put as 'needs must'.

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Kveto from Prague
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Post by Kveto from Prague » Fri January 27th, 2012, 6:45 pm

interesting. we were discussing this term yesterday at the office. The closest modern equivalent is the term "have to". If you look at literature written 150 plus years ago you will never encounter the term "have to". It is a recent addition to common usage (im not sure how long it has been around but it has only grown in popularity in relatively recent history)

The discussion was originally regarding the modal "must" and the semi-modal "have to" as to how they used to have different connotations but are now fairly the same, particularly in North American English (still open to debate but give it 15 years)

If you read any older authors like Henty and Haggard when trying to write about the past. They will use "need" and "must needs" but never "have to".

annis
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Post by annis » Fri January 27th, 2012, 11:30 pm

It is an old phrase and as MLE points out, in Middle English and Elizabethan usage it was "must needs" - in fact, only in more recent times did it become "needs must". These days it has quite an archaic feel and is gradually disappaearing, except for old sayings still in common use like "Needs must when thre devil drives".

http://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/needs-must.html
Last edited by annis on Fri January 27th, 2012, 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Brenna
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Post by Brenna » Sun January 29th, 2012, 7:52 pm

Thanks everyone! I finally finished Tranter's trilogy on The Bruce. If you are looking for a comprehensive version of Bruce, this is it!
Brenna

Tom Miers
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Post by Tom Miers » Fri June 22nd, 2012, 2:47 pm

[quote=""LCW""]I just bought a kindle and am in the process of stocking it with books. I'm interested in reading about Robert Bruce. I know that Nigel Tranter's book is supposed to be excellent but there's another author Gemini Sasson that I'm not sure about. Has anyone read any of this author's work? They look a little more romancy than Tranter's, which I'm ok with as long as they're not terrible.[/quote]

Not sure about Sasson, but the Tranter books are great (or the Bruce trilogy is anyway - he wrote loads of others and they get a bit noddy). Learnt most of my Scottish history from them! Tom Miers (David Capel)

ArthurRussell
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Post by ArthurRussell » Fri July 27th, 2012, 1:47 pm

I hope you're well stocked at this stage. My contribution might be a little late, but Robert is a driving force behind the book's plot, as he helps his little brother invade an unruley Celtic Isle (aka Ireland). That would be Morgallion by Arthur Russell (my self of course :-) . Good look with the virtual shelf-fleshing.
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"Morgallion" a medieval epic based in Ireland during deBruce's invasion.

website: http://www.morgallion.com
blog: http://www.morgallion.com

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