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The Iron Lady

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princess garnet
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Post by princess garnet » Sat November 19th, 2011, 7:46 pm

I remember during Pres. Reagan's funeral, the Baroness had a taped eulogy done despite her frail health and it was shown on TV.

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Ken
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Post by Ken » Sat November 19th, 2011, 9:35 pm

[quote=""parthianbow""]@Rowan: you've certainly picked a good topic to start a debate.

For me, Thatcher will be remembered for:

smashing the unions (admittedly, they needed reining in, but to this day, only a fraction of UK workers are in one, and in many people's minds, workers' rights now are poorer than they were back then).

'They needed reining in?' I don't think that this forum is for this sort of political comment, but I can't let this pass, I'm 71 yrs old and I remember it well! They (the unions) were driving this country into the ground! This end of November the public sector unions are going to go on strike again (in spite of a very good offer from the Government) because their (protected) pensions are being brought into line with those of the (unprotected) private sector who can't strike for the same reason!

'burying the coal mining industry (when many of the mines were still profitable. Some have since been reopened)'. The mines were hopelessly unprofitable because of the mad union protectionist policies, to the point where no-one would buy our coal and it was cheaper for us to import coal from say Poland, than use our own!

'instituting a shoot-to-kill policy in Northern Ireland that saw IRA men executed on the street by special forces rather than being offered a chance to surrender. (This while condemning acts of similar horrific acts of violence by the IRA.).' Can't remember Thatcher ordering the planting of bombs all over Ireland to kill Irish citizens!

'laying the legacy that saw her party sell off nationalised industry (rail, water, electricity) at bargain basement prices to cronies of the government.' That's called capitalism. Which Govenment sold off all our gold at rock bottom prices? And which Government opened the floodgates of uncontrolled immigration over the last 10 years?

I for one will not be going to see the film, or ever watch it on TV/DVD. I cannot abide her.[/quote]. You're entitled to your opinion! I don't share it and don't think you speak for the majority - you don't!

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Post by SGM » Sat November 19th, 2011, 9:54 pm

[quote=""rebecca""] I also remember rumours that the Argentine Government tried to avoid a war over the Falklands but that Maggie refused to have any discussion about it. I always wondered if there was any truth to that?

Bec :) [/quote]

I don't know the truth about the Falklands discussions either but I do know that what here is referred to as The Falklands Factor has caused political analysts endless problems to try and explain. I heard one say that it is something that was not supposed to exist but everyone knew did. However, Mrs T went from being the most unpopular PM ever (but that does to tend to happen 'mid-term') to one of great longevity for an elected PM.
Currently reading - Emergence of a Nation State by Alan Smith

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Vanessa
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Post by Vanessa » Sun November 20th, 2011, 11:17 am

I can remember my mum watching her on TV and saying 'three cheers for the ladies!' She thought she was great. I think she did a good job at first but towards the end I thought it was time for someone new. I think there have been worse prime ministers, one springs to my mind as I type!
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Books are mirrors, you only see in them what you already have inside you ~ The Shadow of the Wind

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Post by SGM » Sun November 20th, 2011, 4:30 pm

[quote=""Vanessa""]I can remember my mum watching her on TV and saying 'three cheers for the ladies!' She thought she was great. I think she did a good job at first but towards the end I thought it was time for someone new. I think there have been worse prime ministers, one springs to my mind as I type![/quote]

I think it will be easier for those outside the UK to watch and enjoy this film. I suspect there will never be a meeting of minds between the anti- and the pro-Thatcherites (hence the divisive comment).
Currently reading - Emergence of a Nation State by Alan Smith

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parthianbow
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Post by parthianbow » Sun November 20th, 2011, 5:03 pm

@Ken: perhaps the debating area would have been better for a discussion. I'd be more than happy to debate Thatcher with you there, especially as you missed my point in at least two places. You also threw out accusations about another government, points which had absolutely nothing to with what I had said.

I think that you might also find it easier to make a point better by not putting an exclamation! mark! at the end of every sentence! It sounds as if you're shouting otherwise. (Maybe you were!)

Furthermore, I began my post by stating "For me", so it was clear from the outset that I didn't think I was speaking for anyone but myself, something you also seem to have missed. And despite your references to 'the majority', I can assure other readers that vast swathes of the UK hold no fond feelings for Thatcher. Whether it's a majority, I have no idea, but if it isn't, it's at the very least a very large minority.
Ben Kane
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EC2
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Post by EC2 » Mon November 21st, 2011, 5:42 pm

I'm not and never have been a political animal. From my perspective, she had strength and charisma and a clear sense of what she wanted to achieve. Woolly was not something you'd ever say of Margaret Thatcher. However, some of her policies and methods left much to be desired. I respected Maggie in a way that I will never respect someone like Tony Blair. At least she'd look you in the eyes as she bit you rather than smile and look the other way, pretending it wasn't her at all.
Les proz e les vassals
Souvent entre piez de chevals
Kar ja li coard n’I chasront

'The Brave and the valiant
Are always to be found between the hooves of horses
For never will cowards fall down there.'

Histoire de Guillaume le Mareschal

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Post by rebecca » Tue November 22nd, 2011, 12:51 am

[quote=""EC2""]I'm not and never have been a political animal. From my perspective, she had strength and charisma and a clear sense of what she wanted to achieve. Woolly was not something you'd ever say of Margaret Thatcher. However, some of her policies and methods left much to be desired. I respected Maggie in a way that I will never respect someone like Tony Blair. At least she'd look you in the eyes as she bit you rather than smile and look the other way, pretending it wasn't her at all.[/quote]

You know I really can't put my finger on it but there was always something about Tony Blair that I didn't trust and yet he had the smile, the wave the gift of the gab.....Perhaps it was the charm which is vastly different from sincerity. But I suppose his two greatest acts was peace in Northern Ireland and his involvement in Serbia which stopped a mass slaughter.

All in all I think I preferred the more dour Brown than Blair....but then again I don't trust too many politicians at all.

Bec :)

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Vanessa
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Currently reading: The Farm at the Edge of the World by Sarah Vaughan
Interest in HF: The first historical novel I read was Katherine by Anya Seton and this sparked off my interest in this genre.
Favourite HF book: Gone with the Wind by Margaret Mitchell!
Preferred HF: Any
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Post by Vanessa » Tue November 22nd, 2011, 9:58 am

I'm the other way around. Whilst I didn't find Tony Blair particularly sincere, I thought he had charisma, whereas Gordon Brown had zilch. I didn't like him at all.
currently reading: My Books on Goodreads

Books are mirrors, you only see in them what you already have inside you ~ The Shadow of the Wind

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EC2
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Post by EC2 » Tue November 22nd, 2011, 3:00 pm

I love this Steve Knightly song about Tony Blair. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=andAg5RnC8g

Sorry, this is getting off topic isn't it? I'll shut up. but I do love this as a modern folk song.
Les proz e les vassals
Souvent entre piez de chevals
Kar ja li coard n’I chasront

'The Brave and the valiant
Are always to be found between the hooves of horses
For never will cowards fall down there.'

Histoire de Guillaume le Mareschal

www.elizabethchadwick.com

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