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Dogs

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Alaric
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Post by Alaric » Thu September 18th, 2008, 10:30 am

"The Romans had attack formations made entirely of dogs."

What they used to do was unleash them after they (the enemy) had broken formation and began running. The dogs would chase them all over the place and let the legionaries pick them off at will, rather than actually have to run themselves. It was a useful substitute in the absence of cavalry :) and in the forests in Germania.

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Rowan
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Post by Rowan » Thu September 18th, 2008, 1:21 pm

I got the impression that they might've been long haired dogs because at one point in the book I'm reading Breaca says they should shave her dog Stone's coat so that it looks like he's got mange and the Romans would leave him alone. It's been at least 6 years since I've encountered an Irish Wolfhound and that encounter left an indellible mark on my olfactory senses... do they tend to have long hair? And by long I'm meaning longer than, say, what a Labrador has.

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LCW
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Post by LCW » Thu September 18th, 2008, 4:24 pm

Whoops, annis, I posted the wrong link! Sorry, you got the right one!

[quote=""Rowan""]I got the impression that they might've been long haired dogs because at one point in the book I'm reading Breaca says they should shave her dog Stone's coat so that it looks like he's got mange and the Romans would leave him alone. It's been at least 6 years since I've encountered an Irish Wolfhound and that encounter left an indellible mark on my olfactory senses... do they tend to have long hair? And by long I'm meaning longer than, say, what a Labrador has.[/quote]

The Caucasian Shepherd is a descendant of these medieval molassar war dogs and it has extremely fluffy hair. So thick that a wolf could'nt get it's teeth to it's skin. There were probably a variety of coat lengths back then, just as there are today, depending on what job the dog was bred for.

Irishwolf hounds have scruffy wiry sort of hair, not really long, IMO:
Irish Wolfhound

I have a hard time thinking of IW's as vicious war dogs. I've known two in my life and they were both sweet goofy babies with the funniest cartoon like faces I've ever seen. But that is more likely the result of the "watering down" of temperments we see in modern time while preserving only the look of the dog!
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Margaret
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Post by Margaret » Thu September 18th, 2008, 7:13 pm

Here's another link, from one of the references posted at the end of the Wikipedia article, with better photos: http://penelope.uchicago.edu/~grout/enc ... nings.html. I'm not sure if this would be a British war hound, but I do know that British war hounds were a major export item (along with leather and grain) from Britain to the Continent in the period before the Roman Conquest of Britain. Since the climate there was fairly cold compared to the Continent (and to Italy especially) it seems likely the dogs would have good, thick coats.

Dogs were high-status animals in Celtic areas: the first part of Cuchullain's name (Cu) means "hound." So does the first part of the name of the king in sixth century Cornwall - Conomor - who is believed to have been the model for "King Mark" in the Tristan and Isolde stories.

What a fun thread this is!
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Rowan
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Post by Rowan » Thu September 18th, 2008, 8:21 pm

[quote=""Margaret""]What a fun thread this is![/quote]

I'm glad you feel so! :D :D

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Post by Eigon » Tue September 23rd, 2008, 8:58 pm

Wasn't Cuchullain's name a nickname, though? I seem to remember a legend where he was late for a feast, so the dogs had been let out to guard the hall - and he killed the host's dog when it attacked him, so he promised to be the man's dog and guard his hall.

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Post by annis » Wed September 24th, 2008, 6:11 am

Yes, his true name was Sétanta, and he did take the name Cúchulainn after killing Culann's guard dog; Cúchulainn meaning Culann's hound as he offered to be a replacement guard for the hound he killed.
There are lots of stories around based on the Ulster Cycle featuring Cúchulainn, but a recent version which I enjoyed was "Hound" by George Green.

Do you take your nom de forum from the Eigon who was the daughter of British chieftain Caratacus? I 've just been reading a time-slip novel about her- Barbara Erskine's "The Warrior Princess".
Last edited by annis on Wed September 24th, 2008, 6:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Eigon » Thu October 23rd, 2008, 8:57 pm

Not only was Eigon the daughter of King Caractacus, but the church in the next village down the road is the only one in Wales dedicated to her!
Caractacus had a hillfort in the area, and the legend goes that, when he was captured and taken to Rome, Eigon went with him. There she met St Paul, also a prisoner, converted to Christianity, and when she came home, she built the first Christian church in Britain at Llanigon. Glastonbury is a Johnnny-come-lately according to the local legend!

More prosaically, Llanigon church is named after a follower of St David, who sent monks out to spread the Gospel all over Wales.

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Post by annis » Fri October 24th, 2008, 5:59 pm

In Barbara Erskine's "Warrior Princess" Eigon does become a Christian in Rome and return home to spread the word.

I believe that Cefyn Carnedd is considered the most likely spot for Caratacus' last stand against the Romans.

How exciting to live so close to an area where historic events took place.
After I read "Warrior Princess" I went cyber-searching and came across this article about Caratacus' campaign, which is quite well done (even if it' a backgrounder for a game!)
http://www.avalanchepress.com/CelticTwilight.php

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