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What do you think of the Government bailout?

A place to debate issues or to rant about what's on your mind. In addition to discussions about historical fiction, books, the publishing industry, and history, discussions about current political, social, and religious issues and other topics are allowed, so those who are easily offended by certain topics may want to avoid such threads. Members are expected to keep the discussions friendly and polite and to avoid personal attacks on other members. The moderators reserve the right to shut down a thread without warning if they believe it necessary.
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Divia
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Post by Divia » Tue September 30th, 2008, 12:28 am

I heard, and I'm not sure if I understood this correctly but because the DOW fell so much that Americans who had stakes in stock lost ahem 1 TRILLION dollars.

:eek:
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diamondlil
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Post by diamondlil » Tue September 30th, 2008, 2:54 am

And that is just in the US. All the stock markets around the world are following suit as well.

In terms of percentage, the crash is supposed to be worse than the one in 1929.
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Divia
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Post by Divia » Tue September 30th, 2008, 3:08 am

That doesnt give me a warm fuzzy feeling inside! :(
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LCW
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Post by LCW » Tue September 30th, 2008, 5:05 am

[quote=""Divia""]I heard, and I'm not sure if I understood this correctly but because the DOW fell so much that Americans who had stakes in stock lost ahem 1 TRILLION dollars.

:eek: [/quote]


Yep, you heard right! The house Republicans threw a trillion dollar temper tantrum!!
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donroc
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Post by donroc » Tue September 30th, 2008, 12:38 pm

Repeat, 90 dems voted nay including a dozen or more on Barney Frank's committee.

Market is up 150+ this AM re. futures. Overseas is doing better too.

Lotsa manure spread by both sides.

A mild panic always shakes up the gamblers.

Drop yesterday was #17 in % on the panic scale.

The middle class (and who agrees on what that is?) was getting the shaft. The White House was helping the fat cats with a blank check. The lefty dems were buying votes from the poor with big bucks going to ACORN and other handout orgs.

Small businesses were being hurt most.

The crisis will be resolved with a bit more time, cooler heads, and less posturing -- and some fools in Congress on both sides keeping quiet for a change.
Last edited by donroc on Tue September 30th, 2008, 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Alaric » Tue September 30th, 2008, 1:30 pm

[quote=""diamondlil""]In terms of percentage, the crash is supposed to be worse than the one in 1929.[/quote]

But without nearly as severe consequences, which is the key thing. The rise of the Chinese, Indian, Russian and Brazilian economies means the damage is less for a lot of countries whose trade and stocks there have increased dramatically. For Australia there is no real noticeable impact on our exports as our #1 market is China, not the United States, which is one of the biggest differences so we can take the hit better.

Still, it's not the end of the world (unlike what the mass media want us to believe). This crash isn't as bad as the one in 1987. I mean, there's recessions all the time and countries bounce back as strong as ever. Japan went worse than this in the 80s and bounced back so strongly they were unaffected by the Asian Financial Crisis of 1997. In fifteen years time there will probably be another recession, and another one after that, and another after that. It's the consequence of a free market capitalist economy!
Last edited by Alaric on Tue September 30th, 2008, 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Rowan
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Post by Rowan » Tue September 30th, 2008, 3:16 pm

Okay, my first question is... is this really a debate if we're all of the same mind? :p I mean I've not read every single post verbatim, but I get the feeling that we're all of the same mind on this subject.

You know, I'm 36 and I admit that in my 20s I made some very poor financial decisions. I didn't exactly go crazy with two credit cards - never maxed them out or even came close - but I backed myself into a corner that I couldn't easily get out of on the meager salary I made. Comparatively speaking, my debt was a drop in the bucket, but not once did I ever ask for any kind of help from the government for the mistake I made. As someone else said (I think it was MLE), people want to be free of Big Brother until we mess up our lives and then expect BB to race in and make everything better. Oh how wonderful life would be if that happened in every aspect of our lives!!

Just the other night, I was talking to a neighbour across the street who'd come over to visit. We were standing outside chatting when he said, "You see we're about to lose some neighbours?" I hadn't, until then, noticed the For Sale sign in front of the house two doors down from him. "They can't handle the payments anymore. They're paying $2,000 a month." My jaw hit the ground. Now I live with my parents so I don't have to make any mortgage payments, but I am more than certain they don't pay over $1,000 a month, if that. Apparently the couple had horrible credit and put very little toward a downpayment. But they had to have a house.

I have a friend in Florida who lives in a two bedroom apartment with her boyfriend and his three daughters. You can imagine they want to live in a house in the worst way, but unlike most people they know what they can afford and what they can't.

I don't want this bailout any more than anyone else does mostly because no one really knows if it will work or not. I think all CEOs and all other top executives should be stripped of their assets and paid minimum wage like real Americans are. Add up all that money and see how far that gets us in reviving the economy.

What depresses me most about all of this is the fact that it takes away from me being able to achieve my dreams. All of those fat cats on Wall Street don't give a flying rat's arse about anyone but themselves.
:( :( :(

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Leyland
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Post by Leyland » Tue September 30th, 2008, 4:40 pm

[quote=""Rowan""]
I don't want this bailout any more than anyone else does mostly because no one really knows if it will work or not. I think all CEOs and all other top executives should be stripped of their assets and paid minimum wage like real Americans are. Add up all that money and see how far that gets us in reviving the economy. [/quote]

I'd like to see CEO's who've essentially criminally 'mismanaged' these financial firms to be assessed some very high penalties considering the outcomes of their executive decisions.

Bills can be revised, so I'd like to have seen the one voted upon passed yesterday primarily to prevent yesterday's historic stock market plunge. No law is written in stone, so at least a passed bill could have been in the works and changed under bipartisan efforts before continuing along the process.

I surely don't want a government intervention at this point to set a precedent for future credit mismanagement bailouts, but I believe that the devalued mortgage backed securities the government would purchase and hold, would become profitable in the future. I've got faith in most of my fellow citizens. :)

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LCW
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Post by LCW » Tue September 30th, 2008, 6:54 pm

You know how they all say that there will be no "golden parachutes" for CEO's?? That's BS!! Any NEW contracts made with CEO's of companies participating in the bailout will not go over $500,000 but if the CEO ALREADY has a contract for $50 million dollars it will be honored! So even the fatcats who screwed everything up will still walk away with millions since their original contracts will be honored. WTH???

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Rowan
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Post by Rowan » Tue September 30th, 2008, 7:43 pm

I'm so glad that, for the most part, no one here is pointing fingers at who is to blame outside of those who mismanaged money entrusted to them. I'm getting weary of the Democrats and Republicans saying it's the others fault for this mess.

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