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Historical Arthur

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Anna Elliott
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Post by Anna Elliott » Sun August 22nd, 2010, 5:24 pm

Cat, there's also the very interesting theory of equating Arthur and/or Ambrosius with Riothamus, who is mentioned by the chronicler Jordanes as 'king of the Britons.' There are parallels with the Arthur story--like his battle near the Burgundian town of Avallon, which might have been the basis for the Arthurian connection to Avalon.

I suspect no one will ever prove conclusively who the 'real' Arthur was, but it's certainly fun to track down the various threads of evidence and speculate!

Author of the Twilight of Avalon trilogy
new book: Dark Moon of Avalon, coming Sept 14 from Simon &Schuster (Touchstone)

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cat
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Post by cat » Sun August 22nd, 2010, 8:08 pm

I had read about Riothamus possibly being one of the candidates for the real Arthur...have you read Mike Ashley's 'The Mammoth Book of King Arthur'? He gives quite a lot of good arguments and information.

What is your favorite source for information on Arthur? I'm hungry to read more! But it is endless isn't it? *laughs*
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annis
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Post by annis » Sun August 22nd, 2010, 8:22 pm

Posted by cat
What is your favorite source for information on Arthur? I'm hungry to read more! But it is endless isn't it? *laughs*
I'd suggest the Britannia History website, which has links to sources both ld and new:
http://www.britannia.com/history/h12.html

Personally I think that though it's fun to speculate about the possibilities of a real Arthur, it's almost better that we don't discover him. The magic of Arthur is the mystery. As Gwyna says in Philip Reeve's excellent teenage novel Here Lies Arthur, “It didn’t matter any longer what the truth about Arthur had been. What mattered was the stories.”

Bernard Cornwell's Thomas Hookton had the right idea when he tossed the Grail into the sea :)

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cat
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Post by cat » Sun August 22nd, 2010, 8:34 pm

I have the Britannia History website bookmarked already as one of my main online resources - great site!
As Gwyna says in Philip Reeve's excellent teenage novel Here Lies Arthur, “It didn’t matter any longer what the truth about Arthur had been. What mattered was the stories.”
That is an excellent way to look at it! For me, it is all about what Arthur represents - uniting Britain and protecting her people from threat. I admire what he stood for more than anything else; a true and noble leader that inspired loyalty and faith. The stories gave people hope, didn't they?
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Anna Elliott
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Post by Anna Elliott » Mon August 23rd, 2010, 12:39 am

I loved Here Lies Arthur! And that's exactly it, the Arthurian legends are so powerful because they give us an ideal of courage and nobility to strive for. That's what first and always attracts me to the legends. To answer your question, Cat, I enjoyed Pendragon by Steve Blake and Scott Lloyd, Geoffrey Ashe has of course written many excellent Arthur books, The Mammoth Book of King Arthur is definitely good--gosh, too many to count, really! It's a fascinating subject.

And even though I do the vast, vast majority of my research in books, the Early British Kingdoms website is an excellent resource for more information on the period.

Author of the Twilight of Avalon trilogy
new book: Dark Moon of Avalon, coming Sept 14 from Simon &Schuster (Touchstone)

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TonyHays
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To echo Anna ...

Post by TonyHays » Mon August 23rd, 2010, 12:05 pm

Jordanes did indeed mention Riothamus, but nearly as importantly, a poet and one-time son-in-law to a Roman emperor, Sidonius Appollinaris wrote a letter to this Riothamus which still exists. The character traits that he attributes to Riothamus - a sense of justice, honor, fairness - could have come straight from Malory. Geoffrey Ashe stakes a good bit on this letter. His book, The Discovery of King Arthur, was released in an updated edition in 2003 by Sutton. Christopher Snyder, who has written some fine books on the history of the post Roman period, has said that this new edition of Ashe's book is one of the most important books published on the historical Arthur in decades.

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cat
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Post by cat » Mon August 23rd, 2010, 10:00 pm

[quote=""Anna Elliott""]To answer your question, Cat, I enjoyed Pendragon by Steve Blake and Scott Lloyd, Geoffrey Ashe has of course written many excellent Arthur books...[/quote]

I was also going to add that I'd found Blake and Lloyd's book very insightful too. I have just picked up one of Ashe's texts but haven't had time to read it yet. Glad to know he's on your list as I'm sure I'll find it helpful if you did too!
And even though I do the vast, vast majority of my research in books, the Early British Kingdoms website is an excellent resource for more information on the period.
Ooooh! Thank you for that one too! One can never have enough good sources. *laughs* As you said, it's endless!

And to Tony- thank you for the great recommendation in Ashe's work as well. I need to get reading!!
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TonyHays
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In the interest of full disclosure

Post by TonyHays » Mon August 23rd, 2010, 10:46 pm

I have to acknowledge that Geoffrey and his wife are friends of mine. When I began my own Arthurian project, I wrote Geoffrey and asked if he would see me and let me pick his brain if I came to Glastonbury. He immediately said yes, and in the nearly six years since then, they have become dear friends. But, I had been a fan of his work for years already.

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Post by chuck » Mon August 23rd, 2010, 11:17 pm

Regarding Arthur.....I always liked this quote..."When the legend become fact print the legend".....BTW annis...I'm reading Horn's "Here Lies Arthur"....really enjoying it....

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Post by annis » Tue August 24th, 2010, 1:29 am

Hi Chuck - glad you're enjoying Here Lies Arthur. I think it a delectably subversive piece of work, and so well written - when I come across bits like -- "my words took flight upon the music and wheeled about like swifts under the roof-beams", I just go "aahhh"!

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