The Gothic Novel

[chuck]

I hope this genre has not been discussed in a previous thread.....I have always wondered what makes a good Gothic Novel.... You as lovers of HF how would you define a Gothic Novel.....I realize their are classic definitions abound..... Please give me/us your suggestions of some novels you have read .....No need to give a review unless you prefer to....

A few favorites.....

Henry James...Turn of the Screw

Edgar Allan Poe....The Telltale Heart

Bram Stoker....Dracula

HAPPY HOLLOWEEN.....:eek:

[Volgadon]

Anything by Monk Lewis. Oh, and parts of the 3 Musketeers.

[Vanessa]

Dracula - Bram Stoker
Wuthering Heights - Emily Bronte
Jane Eyre - Charlotte Bronte
Rebecca - Daphne du Maurier
My Cousin Rachel - Daphne du Maurier
The Woman in Black - Susan Hill
The Thirteenth Tale - Diane Setterfield
The Ghost Writer - John Harwood


Victoria Holt and Mary Stewart wrote good gothic style books, too.

[annis]

This is a cool idea, Chuck!

Technically the Gothic period in literature started with Horace Walpole's 1764 novel "the Castle of Otranto', peaked with Ann Radcliffe's late C18th and Regency mysteries and was finished by about 1840. I once got told off by someone when I described "Emily Bronte's "Wuthering Heights" as a gothic novel, because it's apparently outside the strict literary period, but as far as I'm concerned it was certainly heir to the gothic tradition which was also an inspiration to the Romantics of the later Victorian era.

i quite like this piece which describes elements which make a gothic novel
http://www.virtualsalt.com/gothic.htm
If not strictly within the Gothic period, many novels since have certainly used gothic elements and fit into that genre, so I don't see why we can't call them gothic novels!

Some of my favorites:
"Wuthering Heights" Emily Bronte
"Rebecca" Daphne du Maurier
"The Fall of the House of Ussher" by Edgar Allan Poe
"The Wolves of Willoughby Chase" by Joan Aiken (YA)
"The Woman in White" Wilkie Collins
"Frankenstein", Mary Bysshe Shelly
"The Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde" Robert Louis Stevenson
"The Picture of Dorian Gray" Oscar Wilde

[Ludmilla]

The Literary Gothic is a great website for all things Gothic (you'll find it by googling; I'm too lazy to link). It's got the article that Annis posted, which really covers the bases. Some others I've enjoyed (I'm mixing true Gothics with some of those more recent modern ones that were inspired by):

"Seven Gothic Tales", Isak Dinesen
"The House of Seven Gables", Nathaniel Hawthorne
"Carmilla", JS LeFanu
"Affinity", Sarah Waters
"We Have Always Live in the Castle", Shirley Jackson
"The Historian", Elizabeth Kostova
"The Master of Ballantrae" RL Stevenson (some might think it's just adventure, but there are some gothic elements in this one, too)
One of my favorite short stories is "The Yellow Wallpaper" by Charlotte Perkins Gilman.

I know I've read a lot more than this, but these are some that spring to mind.

[diamondlil]

A more recent novel with some gothic elements is The Thirteenth Tale by Diane Setterfield.

[annis]

I forgot to add Jane Austen's "Northanger Abbey", though strictly speaking that's a satirical gothic novel. Of course the gothic novel does lend itself to satire and parody quite nicely.

[chuck]

Thanks to all for the interesting list of books and links....For me a little bit of Gothic in HF is a good thing....many new additions to TBR pile......"The unknown evil that lurks behind the door".......

[xiaotien]

i recently read iris murdoch's
the unicorn, and it was referred
to as a gothic novel as well.

not sure how authentic it is
to the genre, as it was written
in the 60's. i do think the feel of
the novel was gothic?

[annis]

I'd say that the "Unicorn" fits into the gothic genre, xiaotien. You have the beautiful heroine trapped in the castle with its derelict garden, set in the dramatic, isolated west coast Irish landscape, and all sorts of elemental undertones of jealousy and rage.

What I think is that sure, there is a distinct Gothic literary period, but that there is also a gothic genre which uses certain motifs central to the original Gothic novels, and this applies to novels being written currently as well as to older books.

I guess the most recent gothic novel I read was "Kept" (http://www.amazon.com/Kept-Victorian-D-J-Taylor/dp/0061146080/ref=pd_bbs_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1221866319&sr=8-1), by D.J. Taylor.

I'm wondering about Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes novels as well - surely something like "Hound of the Baskervilles" qualifies as gothic?

[xiaotien]

omg, annis.
you've read murdoch?

will you be my friend?? :o

[annis]

Lol! A did read several iris Murdoch novels back in the day- but the day is unfortunately a long way back. The first of her novels that I read was "The Bell", which really struck me at the time - well-developed characters and powerful imagery - the story is still clear in my mind after all these years.
I was very young and innocent then, and didn't know anything about the homosexuality which made for so much of dynamic tension in the story, so that was a bit of a surprise and an education for me!

[Cuchulainn]

I guess the novel that started it all was Horace Walpole's "The Castle of Otranto"

I own Jane Austen's "Northanger Abbey," but have never read it. I'm sort of out the whole vibe of literature from around that period. Is Northanger Abbey worth a read, though?

[annis]

I guess it depends whether you like Jane Austen's writing, Cuchulainn.
"Northanger Abbey" is a gothic parody, or I should say, a satire about the fashion for reading gothic novels, rather than a straight gothic novel. A young girl, Catherine is invited to visit Northanger Abbey, the estate of some new friends. Because she has been reading Ann Radcliffe's gothic novel "The Mysteries of Udolpho", and other gothic novels, the impressionable Catherine expects Northanger Abbey to be dark, ancient and full of fantastical mystery. She makes a lot of strange assumptions based on the ideas she's picked up from reading gothic tales, including suspecting her host of murder.
She ends up upseting everyone, embarrassing herself and realising that life doesn't correspond to fiction, though all turns out well in the end,
It's JA-style gentle irony, probably a bit more obvious than in some of her other books.
I should point out that most of the interaction takes place during the usual acceptable Regency social activities, so it's definitely not a high-action story.

[chuck]

Edgar Allan Poe's short novel, "Murders In The Rue Morgue" had some definite Gothic imagery.....It gave me the shivers....Also I have seen some silver screen of adaptions... very creepy.....

[annis]

Yes, "Murders in the Rue Morgue" was a real spinechiller. I mentioned before that i see Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes novels as having definite gothic elements as well - I'm thinking of stories like "Hound of the Baskervilles"- the remote, isolated house on the gloomy moors, mysterious happenings, and over all, the haunting howl of the hound- guaranteed to get the hair on the back of your neck rising!

[chuck]

Yes, "Murders in the Rue Morgue" was a real spinechiller. I mentioned before that i see Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's Sherlock Holmes novels as having definite gothic elements as well - I'm thinking of stories like "Hound of the Baskervilles"- the remote, isolated house on the gloomy moors, mysterious happenings, and over all, the haunting howl of the hound- guaranteed to get the hair on the back of your neck rising!

Selene....you are spot on....Yes! Doyle's HOTB; the Gothic imagery is terrific( wonder why anybody would be walking the Moors after dark?)....I love a bit of the Gothic supernatural weaved into the storyline....I'm reading another Barbara Erskine time slip novel called "Midnight is a Lonely Place" very interesting touch of the supernatural when the main character keeps smelling fresh soil accompanied with maggots, very creepy...the story as it develops is a bit of a stretch and her characters are a bit predictable....but I'm enjoying the ride

[annis]

"Midnight is a Lonely Place" is the most gothic of BE's novels, I think. I found it really quite creepy. I've not long since finished I her latest novel, "Warrior's Princess" which also has a Roman British theme. It's the usual scenario- modern-day woman gets caught up in unfinished business from the oast. In this case the past thread belongs to Eigon daughter of British chieftain Caratacus (Caradoc in the British language). When Caratacus was defeated by the Romans he and his family were carted off to Rome, but C made a famous speech which so affected the Emperor Claudius and the Senate that they allowed him to stay in Rome as an honoured "guest" rather than making him lion fodder at the Colosseum.

Though Eigon's story was interesting, I found myself feeling impatient at times at the familiar formula- once you've read a few BE novels, the pattern is pretty predictable.

Jane found this poem for me a while ago- I'd been looking for it for ages- remembered it from the past. It's written in typically florid Victorian style, but for some reason it caught my fancy when I was young.
"Caractacus the Briton" from "Lays of Romance and Chivalry" by William Stewart Ross"
http://www.archive.org/details/laysofromancechi00ross

PS Have you seen the "Michael Palin for President" video clip on You Tube? As a Monty Python fan, I know you'd enjoy it.
There's a link in the "Chat" thread.

[chuck]

Annis....Michael Palin For President...What a hoot....Deeply Religious...he will get my vote.....I miss the rowdy lads.....Their humor is so timelss..... they helped me get through the Nixon and Reagan eras....Caractacus, his compelling and interesting life would make a great film......Yes BE's character fall into a sameness and are quite predictable.....Still I might give "Lady of Hay" a go, before I tackle Ennis's "Byzantium"

[Volgadon]

Gogol occasionaly pulled off a good gothic tale. Viy is incredibly creepy, a novice has to hold a vigil over the body of a witch inside an old, gloomy village church. If he steps out of his chalk circle she will destroy him. On the last night various horrible demons and creatures are summoned.
the Eve of Ivan Kupala (or St John's Eve) is also very gothic. A poor labourer wants to marry the village beauty but her father refuses. A very mysterious and nefarious character shows him how to find a buried treasure using the fern blossom. Of course, as with any encounter with darkness, the results are tragic and bloody. Very gothic, as good as any Poe.

[LoveHistory]

Northanger Abbey is wonderful. It's my favorite of all of Jane Austen's novels. And hilarious even if you haven't read any Gothics.

Just got The Castle of Otranto, and so far I'm still reading introductory material (seems to be longer than the actual story).

[annis]

Recently read and really enjoyed Hannah Tinti's "The Good Thief" (http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2008/jul/26/booksforchildrenandteenagers.roundupreviews3?gusrc =rss&feed=books), a rather Dickensian Victorian tale with a distinctly gothic flavour.
It's technically YA fiction, but I'd say that it's in the YA/Adult crossover area.

[Misfit]

Bungay Castle (http://www.amazon.com/Bungay-Castle-Novel-Elizabeth-Bonhote/dp/0976721252/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1231809463&sr=8-1) by Elizabeth Bonhote is an interesting read and perhaps the first teen detectives in a novel. Lots of interesting ups and downs and things that go bump in the night.

[Ludmilla]

Thanks for mentioning the Bonhote novel, Misfit. I have a weakness for some of these older books. This one looks interesting.

[Ludmilla]

Saw this website (http://www.morticiasmorgue.com/gothic.html) with covers from vintage 20th century gothic romance novels. Thought some of you might enjoy browsing through the covers. I recognize many of them, probably read quite a few in my youth, but remember virtually nothing about the plots. Such is the state of my memory these days.

[MLE]

Read the article. By the definitions it gives, Shakespeare's 'A Midsummer Night's Dream' is gothic in all but the castle.

[Miss Moppet]

Saw this website (http://www.morticiasmorgue.com/gothic.html) with covers from vintage 20th century gothic romance novels. Thought some of you might enjoy browsing through the covers.

I love the Helen McInnes 'red staircase' cover. Very atmospheric.

And speaking of covers. Here is a 1965 attempt to market Northanger Abbey to fans of Gothic fiction, just then I think having its biggest vogue since JA's day.

http://www.pemberley.com/janeinfo/nhabgoth.jpg

http://www.pemberley.com/janeinfo/nabgoth2.gif

"What was the mystery surrounding the death of Henry's mother? Was the family concealing a terrible secret within the elegant rooms of the Abbey?"

Um...no.

I hope whoever bought it saw the funny side.

[LoveHistory]

I don't much care for the stuff on the back cover. But that other blurb was hilarious--Catherine almost could have written it herself.

[Miss Moppet]

I don't much care for the stuff on the back cover. But that other blurb was hilarious--Catherine almost could have written it herself.

Yes - this is the novel Catherine thinks she's in.

[nona]

ok so I love Fall, and it's right around the corner so I'm stocking up on some creepy, scary down right frightful books for Halloween (my secret most favorite social gathering of the year). I was wondering if anyone has read any good scary stuff? Recently I read Haunted Lily, Heart Shaped Box and a collaberated ghost story book which I should never have bought, waste of money. Anyways if you can help thanks!

[Divia]

I haven't read it, but its on my shelf and I want to now that my fav holiday is right around the corner.

Oxford book of Victorian Ghost Stories

http://www.amazon.com/Oxford-Book-Victorian-Ghost-Stories/dp/0192804472/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1252036092&sr=8-1

[Ludmilla]

ok so I love Fall, and it's right around the corner so I'm stocking up on some creepy, scary down right frightful books for Halloween (my secret most favorite social gathering of the year). I was wondering if anyone has read any good scary stuff? Recently I read Haunted Lily, Heart Shaped Box and a collaberated ghost story book which I should never have bought, waste of money. Anyways if you can help thanks!

I love Shirley Jackson's books. Have you read The Haunting of Hill House? I also really liked her They Have Always Lived in the Castle (more psychologically disturbing than conventionally scary). Merricat Blackwood is one of the most interesting unreliable narrators ever. The family situation will remind you a little of Arsenic and Old Lace, but without the humor.

[Leo62]

The scariest book I've ever read in my entire life is Naomi's Room by Jonathan Aycliffe. Sadly (or perhaps fortunately!) it's OOP.

It combines elements of psychological mystery/horror and historical ghost story, in a sort of similar way to Hawksmoor. But much, much more disturbing...