View Full Version : The Welsh trilogy
diamondlil
08-26-2008, 10:35 AM
The Welsh trilogy features the books Here Be Dragons, Falls the Shadow and The Reckoning.
Rowan
08-26-2008, 03:56 PM
You know, before I joined HF, I never thought of Wales as being anywhere to really visit, but after reading SKP, I want to visit there as much as anywhere else in the UK.
I'm adding those to my TBR list.
Margaret
08-26-2008, 04:22 PM
I visited Wales in the 1990s. We should have budgeted more time there, because we weren't able to do everything we wanted to do. Wandering around Anglesey Island was fun - I remember a small burial chamber we could go inside (bones all long gone), and there was a nice view of the mountains on the mainland. People very friendly. Cardiff was also fun. I ate laver bread (fried seaweed sandwiches) - very tasty!
I finished SKP Welsh triology earlier today, she really has a way of drawing you into the story. With Here Be Dragons I found I wanted to hate the English and felt Joanna's and Llwellyns turmoil and happiness (didn't understand why she cheated & still don't). I admitt I cried a little when I read the end in Falls the Shadows, and the Reckoning was just as emotional. Definately three of my most favorites. I'm looking to buy all three in hardcover for my little private library, that way I can have a two copies of each.
Tanzanite
09-05-2008, 11:40 PM
Here Be Dragons is one of my favorite books and I think the best of Penman's works.
>(didn't understand why she cheated & still don't).
She felt guilty that her father killed the hostages and wasn't he related to them? The whole book is an emotional tug and pull between her feelings for King John and Llewyllen, both of whom she loved. So I wasn't surprised by it, esp as I think Penman shows it as him instigating it.
That was what I got from it too, Ash. HBD is one of my favorite books! Loved it!
But I have to say I bawled my eyes out more in Falls the Shadow than any other book I think. The Reckoning was great but I didn't shed one tear. Weird!
no I knew she felt guilty for what John did but I would never sleep with him because of the relationship to the victims and my guilty feelings, to me if you love your spouse then you would not cheat under any circumstance, never in my life would I sleep with another man then my husband. I believe she got bored with her husband and he whooed her but I don't understand why she acted on it, does that make sense?
no I knew she felt guilty for what John did but I would never sleep with him because of the relationship to the victims and my guilty feelings, to me if you love your spouse then you would not cheat under any circumstance, never in my life would I sleep with another man then my husband. I believe she got bored with her husband and he whooed her but I don't understand why she acted on it, does that make sense?
Yes, it makes sense to me Nona. I can agree with the way SKP portrays it because it's perfectly feasible that it might have been like that in Joanna's head. Was it really like that in history? Was it really such a great love match between her and Llewelyn? I'd like to think so - I guess a lot of us would, but we'll never know.
when I got to that part in the book I found myself wondering if it was such a match, I guess they loved one another but under the pressure it cracked a little as some relationship do, at least they found it within themselves to move on ad find peace afterward.
I think there are many different scenarios for the Llewelyn/Joanna relationship. SKP creates a plausible one, but there are many others that would fit the bill just as well. I guess this is how it might have been but not necessarily how it was. I've never looked up the full factual history on this, but it might be interesting to do so. I have seen a letter online somewhere from Llewelyn to William Marshal II, talking in diplomatic terms about the execution of Will de Braose - who was the Marshal's brother in law.
Haven't found the letter yet, but here's an url to a sketch of Joanna's tombstone. It's also interesting that the page says her mother is possibly Agatha de Ferrers. The de Ferrers' were earls of Derby.
http://freespace.virgin.net/doug.thompson/BraoseWeb/family/joanwales.html
no I knew she felt guilty for what John did but I would never sleep with him because of the relationship to the victims and my guilty feelings, to me if you love your spouse then you would not cheat under any circumstance, never in my life would I sleep with another man then my husband. I believe she got bored with her husband and he whooed her but I don't understand why she acted on it, does that make sense?
Remember her age (not era, but her chronological age). Girls were often sent out to be married soon after menses. I figured when the book started she was 14,15. By the time this was happening, she'd barely been out of her teen years, and didn't have the wisdom that time so often gives us. At least thats my theory. Also, as I said, she felt horribly guilty, and I can indeed see a young woman going to bed with a man not her spouse for that very reason. There are worse reasons I guess. BTW, I think this only happened once, am I right?\
>SKP creates a plausible one, but there are many others that would fit the bill just as well.
Oh, I totally agree. But its fun to speculate, and fun to try to gleam what the author is trying to suggest.
What I did love was at the very end, when they are old and laughing like old friends who've been through everything together.
But I have to say I bawled my eyes out more in Falls the Shadow than any other book I think. The Reckoning was great but I didn't shed one tear. Weird!
Oh the last one? There wasn't kleenex left in the house by the time I finished that book. In fact, I couldn't get them out of my mind; I told myself how silly I was, greiving for people who died 700 years ago. Tho I think my tears were also that our world hasn't changed all that very much
Funny story - I met Penman at a signing, and told her how moved I was. She laughed and said when she was doing the research for the book, she felt like sheneeded grief counseling!
how funny, I finished the Reckoning at 2 am and woke my husband up sniffeling
Remember her age (not era, but her chronological age). Girls were often sent out to be married soon after menses. I figured when the book started she was 14,15. By the time this was happening, she'd barely been out of her teen years, and didn't have the wisdom that time so often gives us. At least thats my theory. .
Ash, she married Llewelyn in 1205 and the event happened in 1230 when she would have been in her late 30's at least, so not exactly a teenager or even a young woman, but one old enough to have garnered some wisdom.
No one knows when she was born officially; it's not in any historical record. If she did marry at 13 in 1205, she'd have been born in 1192, which would make her 38 in 1230.
Misfit
09-06-2008, 09:51 PM
Whether it really happened or not I just loved the scene where he forgave her. Sob. I did drop a lot of tears in that series.
Whether it really happened or not I just loved the scene where he forgave her. Sob. I did drop a lot of tears in that series.
It is my favourite of all the Penman's. I've read it 3 times I think. A good friend of mine on another board almost missed her wedding because she was desperate to find out what happened next. She was reading HBD in her wedding dress with her hair in rollers!
Misfit
09-06-2008, 10:20 PM
It is my favourite of all the Penman's. I've read it 3 times I think. A good friend of mine on another board almost missed her wedding because she was desperate to find out what happened next. She was reading HBD in her wedding dress with her hair in rollers!
That's having it pretty bad. :D:D
I know when I got to that one spot in The Reckoning I literally had to put the book down and have a good long cry.
Ash, she married Llewelyn in 1205 and the event happened in 1230 when she would have been in her late 30's at least, so not exactly a teenager or even a young woman, but one old enough to have garnered some wisdom.
Thanks for that. Ok, toss that theory out the window :) I still say the guilt; its my story and Im sticking to it till better one comes along
Whether it really happened or not I just loved the scene where he forgave her. Sob. I did drop a lot of tears in that series.
Oh yes!! I was sobbing like a baby! I had to go finish reading upstairs so I could have a good cry without my fiance seeing me.
to me if you love your spouse then you would not cheat under any circumstance, never in my life would I sleep with another man then my husband. I believe she got bored with her husband and he whooed her but I don't understand why she acted on it, does that make sense?
I think infidelity is much more complicated then whether or not you still love your spouse. As long as there has been monogomy there has been infidelity. It's a human condition. There are plenty of people who cheat but who still very much love their spouses. We can argue the morality of someone who is unfaithful but the reasons for it are as varied as the people themselves.
I saw both of my parents being unfaithful to one another then again in later relationships, thats why I'm so stead fast on the fact that I personally could not sleep with another man other then the one I said I do to, pretty sure it doesn't make sense to others but I believe if a person truely and whole hearted love the other unconditionally they would not even think of it. Thats a point of view from a very jaded person when it comes to the other sex and relationships due to experience.
We definitely all have our own experiences! I've never cheated on anyone (other than just dating around when I was much younger) but I've been cheated on by a man who I know loved me. Whether or not he loved me wasn't the issue it was that I just couldn't forgive him. Obviously our relationship was not worth enough to me to want to work it out as there were other issues but love was not one of them.
I've also seen people cheat on each other but work through it and go on to have very loving and solid relationships with each other years later. Complete total faithfulness to one person is obviously the goal, and many many people achieve it, but the reality is that infidelity exists and is just a part of life.
I couldn't stay with someone who'ld cheat. my oldest daughters biological father cheated two weeks before I had her, he said it was the pressure, yeah he wasn't the one working 40 hrs a week and huge, we stayed on friendly terms till he realized I wasn't coming back, which was when I told him I was marrying Ronnie. I always thought once a cheater always a cheater and stuck by my guns regardless of feelings.
back to the triology, guilty of getting off subject, I know she left with a bit of info on Amaury and Guy and other characters but I wonder what happened after Wales was 'English-fied'.
I saw both of my parents being unfaithful to one another then again in later relationships, thats why I'm so stead fast on the fact that I personally could not sleep with another man other then the one I said I do to, pretty sure it doesn't make sense to others but I believe if a person truely and whole hearted love the other unconditionally they would not even think of it. Thats a point of view from a very jaded person when it comes to the other sex and relationships due to experience.
I understand where you are coming from, and see your point.
> I believe if a person truely and whole hearted love the other unconditionally they would not even think of it.
Other than the fact that I am not sure there is such a thing (and you think You're jaded? :) As lila said, the situation is much more complex than simply good or bad. I hope my husband of 20 and I continue to stay true to each other as well as honest with each other. Thats about all one can hope for.
sharon
11-01-2008, 06:10 PM
when I got to that part in the book I found myself wondering if it was such a match, I guess they loved one another but under the pressure it cracked a little as some relationship do, at least they found it within themselves to move on ad find peace afterward.
Hi, Nona,
You and Elizabeth raise a very interesting question, one that haunts writers. We can never really know the hearts of the people we write about. The best we can do is to evaluate the known facts and draw conclusions therefrom. To me, there was no doubt that Llewelyn loved Joanna because he was able to forgive her adultery, and adultery with an Englishman! For any husband, that would have been hard to deal with; imagine how painful it must have been for a prince when there were such dangerous political ramifications because of her betrayal. If he had not truly loved her, he could not have forgiven her. And the proof that they were able to mend the wounds in their marriage was given when she died and he founded a friary in her honor. You must remember that he had nothing to gain by restoring her to favor, for she was not popular with his people. In taking her back, he had to swim against the tide of public opinion.
So I think there is strong case to be made that he loved her. Did she love him? I think so, based on what we know of human nature. Llewelyn was a strong-willed, confident, charismatic individual, married to Joanna for more than 20 years at the time of her betrayal. I find it impossible to believe that he could have nursed an unrequited love for her during those twenty-plus years. In other words, if she had not returned his love, his would have died a natural death, starved into submission. I do not think he could have forgiven her--for her betrayal was political as well as personal, even casting doubts upon the legitimacy of his son Davydd--had he not loved her and had he not been confident that she loved him, too.
I think this is one reason why I always found Llewelyn to be such a fascinating figure in medieval history--that he was strong enough to forgive a public infidelity. Then you have Henry II, of course, who could not bring himself to forgive Eleanor for taking part in the rebellion against him.
It is always tricky to try to interpret human emotions across the span of centuries. Usually if a husband and wife spent most of their time together, that is a good indicator that they had a healthy marriage. Will Marshal and Isabel de Clare are a good example of this, as are the Duke of York and Cecily Neville, and in Devil's Brood, Geoffrey and Constance. When they seem to find reasons to keep apart, as with Richard and Berengaria during the last five years of their marriage, that certainly raises red flags.
Sharon
boswellbaxter
11-01-2008, 06:33 PM
Thanks for stopping by again, Sharon!
What I found hard to comprehend was not that Llewelyn forgave Joanna for her adultery, but that he forgave her for the way she manipulated Gruffyeld (sp? sorry, I haven't got the book in front of me) into threatening his father so that Llewelyn had no choice but to imprison him. It struck me as a calculated and rather cold-blooded act, unlike the adultery, and at that point I'm afraid I lost sympathy for Joanna and never really gained it back. I don't mean this as a criticism of the novel, because I understood that Joanna was motivated largely by her concern for her own son, and later she did seem to feel some regret for what she had done, but it still left a bad taste in my mouth as far as she was concerned. Did you ever find Joanna hard to like?
rex icelingas
03-29-2009, 07:29 PM
This trilogy introduced me to the marvellous Sharon Penman
I know the History behind it so well but was still glued to her words and every twist.All the characters are interesting and multi dimensional we see there reasons behind everything they do,I would even recommend this be read in schools its so good.
I enjoyed Here be Dragons the most,Llewelyn ap Iorweth is my faviroute of the later Twysogion y Gymru
Maybe one day Sharon may return to Wales and do maybe Owain Glyndwr? or Rhys ap Gruffudd?
Haven't found the letter yet, but here's an url to a sketch of Joanna's tombstone. It's also interesting that the page says her mother is possibly Agatha de Ferrers. The de Ferrers' were earls of Derby.
http://freespace.virgin.net/doug.thompson/BraoseWeb/family/joanwales.html
I remember seeing the tomb on one of my trips to Wales. The card by the coffin explained that it had been used as a horse trough for several years! W
This trilogy introduced me to the marvellous Sharon Penman
I know the History behind it so well but was still glued to her words and every twist.All the characters are interesting and multi dimensional we see there reasons behind everything they do,I would even recommend this be read in schools its so good.
I enjoyed Here be Dragons the most,Llewelyn ap Iorweth is my faviroute of the later Twysogion y Gymru
Maybe one day Sharon may return to Wales and do maybe Owain Glyndwr? or Rhys ap Gruffudd?
I believe Sharon mentioned on her blog (she has a regular one now off her website) that once Lionheart is completed and then her novel on Balian of Ibelin, she will be looking to Owain Glyndwr, so that's good news for fans who love the Welsh slant. She sometimes drops by this list too!:)
wealcere
03-30-2009, 05:37 PM
I believe Sharon mentioned on her blog (she has a regular one now off her website) that once Lionheart is completed and then her novel on Balian of Ibelin, she will be looking to Owain Glyndwr, so that's good news for fans who love the Welsh slant. She sometimes drops by this list too!:)
Thanks for the forwarning EC......not Glyndwr!
I'm an Englishman with a right strong accent living in deepest darkest depths of Wales, if thats not bad enough. The last thing I need is Mrs Penmans, Glndwr, on the bookshelves around here. I might have to do a lot of bulk buying, and get even more practice in with my longbows.
I'm just about to start the Welsh Trilogy next, nearly finished Azincourt.
Can it compare to the Sunne? Stupid question really.
SarahWoodbury
03-30-2009, 10:40 PM
And what did Isabella think, to marry Dafydd ap Llywelyn, knowing that her father-in-law had killed her father?
I find the story of Llywelyn ap Gruffydd to be the saddest and most compelling of the three. I want him to have lived!
rex icelingas
03-31-2009, 06:50 AM
If anyone gets the chance to visit the Conwy Valley,look for a place called Trefriw
At the back is some of the finest scenery in Britain and the Church of Llanrychwyn where Llewelyn and Joan would climb to (a personal faviroute of theres)
When Joan could no longer manage the journey he built Trefriw Parish Church
Id love to see Sharon write of Glyndwr she would do the story justice,I would wager that 99% of Welshmen know of Glyndwrs name but nothing about him
Rhys ap Gruffudd would certainly be good for the Penman treatment due to her previous work with Henry II,the Big King and the little King who after years of conflict earn each others respect and possible friendship
Gwenllian ferch Gruffudd ap Cynan may be another good story worth pursuing
Certainly I cant blame writers using Wales,Politically its a fascinating time as well its often strained relationship with the English Crown-the Big Brother,Little Brother kind of thing
Carla
03-31-2009, 04:19 PM
I would love to see Sharon Penman do Owain Glyndwr too!
And what did Isabella think, to marry Dafydd ap Llywelyn, knowing that her father-in-law had killed her father?
I find the story of Llywelyn ap Gruffydd to be the saddest and most compelling of the three. I want him to have lived!
I agree; and what happened to his wife and children was heartbreaking.
SarahWoodbury
04-01-2009, 08:32 PM
'History is written by the victor' and I'm sure that was all Edward I was interested in. He must have been quite a guy--taking on the Welsh and then the Scots, though the Scots have the huge expense of defeating the Welsh and Edward's death to thank for their own survival until Culloden.
I read somewhere that Dafydd, Llywelyn's brother, was the first man to officially be hung, drawn, and quartered (and then dragged through the streets of Shrewsbury). I'm reading Bernard Cornwall's Agincourt right now and am reminded again of the capacity of one man's inhumanity to another.
Misfit
04-02-2009, 04:54 PM
New cover,
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51kNpMCVC6L.jpg
rex icelingas
04-02-2009, 09:12 PM
Thats Cricceth Castle on the Cover
However It looks like Cricceth after it was further adapted by Edward I rather than how it would in Llewelyn ap Iorweth`s day ;)
Misfit
04-02-2009, 09:30 PM
You got my curiosity up and I went googling. Would love to visit that one.
http://www.criccieth.co.uk/assets/images/castle3_250.jpg
http://www.cadw.wales.gov.uk/upload/place/Criccieth03_large4890.jpg
diamondlil
04-03-2009, 09:22 PM
I dont know, it doesn't look like a Sharon Kay Penman cover to me. Its nice enough though.
zsigandr
04-04-2009, 12:16 AM
There hasn't been an SKP historical fiction novel that I haven't liked! I have not tried her historical mysteries, though.
The Wales Trilogy were the most moving novels that I have ever read (actually brought me to tears in a couple of different places).
After reading these novels, I fell in love with Wales and am trying to plan a trip to visit some of the places in her novels as well as to see as much of the country as possible (I know it is part of Great Britain but seems to be a place of its own). Has anyone been to Wales?
boswellbaxter
04-04-2009, 12:29 AM
After reading these novels, I fell in love with Wales and am trying to plan a trip to visit some of the places in her novels as well as to see as much of the country as possible (I know it is part of Great Britain but seems to be a place of its own). Has anyone been to Wales?
Just a very short trip a few years back to Caerphilly Castle. We switched trains at Cardiff but didn't have a chance to look around the city.
After reading these novels, I fell in love with Wales and am trying to plan a trip to visit some of the places in her novels as well as to see as much of the country as possible (I know it is part of Great Britain but seems to be a place of its own). Has anyone been to Wales?
Many many times!:)
I think we have forum members that live in Wales or are close to there. I've often holidayed in North Wales and Anglesey, across the Menai Straits. My brother's in-laws live on Anglesey. I've also been to Pembrokeshire and South Wales. The Welsh language and speakers of such have a greater strength in the North. A lot of the population of South Wales don't speak Welsh. My younger son was at the University of Aberystwyth, so a couple of years ago we were toing and froing across the centre of Wales every few months. Basically get to Shrewsbury. turn left and keep going west until you reach the sea! The scenery is fabulous. It has a tendency to rain quite a lot though :) I've been to most of the castles at some point or another and all have their particular glories. If I had to pick one, it would actually be South Welsh - Manorbier and where Gerald of Wales was born. It's right on the beach and you can actually stay there self catering if you have the money! http://www.forgottenhouses.co.uk/html/housep/manorbier.html We didn't; we were just day visitors, but very impressed by the haunting music coming from hidden speakers in some parts of the ruins. It has a beautiful rustic garden too.
South Wales isn't so much on the beaten track for SKP's Welsh trilogy which tends to concentrate more on the north though - but it's all beautiful and Snowdonia is majestic. I've been to the Dolocauthi gold mines too!
SarahWoodbury
04-04-2009, 02:49 AM
My parents are taking my daughter to Wales for her graduation from high school present. I am so jealous! It has been too long since I've been there, and I wasn't writing about Wales at the time so there is so much that I've missed. Check out the Castles of Wales site: http://www.castlewales.com/
You can find out about what to see that SKP might have mentioned in her books--most of the best-preserved castles that a tourist might see were built by Edward I as part of his conquest of Wales after 1282. To find the Wales of the Welsh Princes, you have to venture a bit more off the beaten path.
After reading these novels, I fell in love with Wales and am trying to plan a trip to visit some of the places in her novels as well as to see as much of the country as possible (I know it is part of Great Britain but seems to be a place of its own). Has anyone been to Wales?
Several times, for the same reason you want to go! The first trip was planned with the trilogy in mind, and I saw many places listed in the book. We stayed in Conwy for this trip, and found it an easy central point to visit the sites. Later trips took me farther afield, looking at more of Edward's castles, as well as exploring Cardiff, and a trip for all book lovers, Hay on Wye. Its a lovely country, with friendly people, and a grand history. Fo
Nefret
04-05-2009, 04:24 AM
Will have to read it when I get the third book. Looks most interesting.
Eigon
04-09-2009, 07:03 PM
If anyone wants a 'native guide' to Hay-on-Wye, look no further - I've lived here for the best part of twenty years! And it is the most wonderful place to live (even though it's a bit expensive!)
I've been to Cardiff a few times, but the motive for going was Doctor Who and Torchwood rather than history! A lot of both the series were filmed there. So I've yet to visit Cardiff Castle, which looks to be well worth a visit for the Victorian splendour.
I spent my childhood going round Conwy, and Caernarvon, and Harlech - and lots of churches in North Wales too, including Ruthin (I think) which has a grave there which was the inspiration for a Victorian poem called "We are Seven", where a little girl insists she's one of seven brothers and sisters, even though one of them is dead.
Another Welsh castle enthusiast is Gabrielle at the blog The Lost Fort - she has some wonderful photos.
And just across the border is Herefordshire, which is presently being immortalised in Phil Rickman's mystery series about Rev Merrily Watkins, the diocesan exorcist! And all the creepy places he writes about really do exist.
Madeleine
04-10-2009, 11:08 AM
Eigon, you are very lucky living in Hay!
I recently read my first Phil Rickman book, and can highly recommend him; it was a bit creepy and had a lot of background info about the Templars.
I've only been to Wales once and that was last May, when I went to Tenby for the weekend - pretty town, fabulous beach and the town still has quite a lot of its ancient walls. Lovely countryside too, although yes it does rain quite a bit!
wealcere
04-26-2009, 08:29 PM
I feel the need to share my enthusiasm..............
Just finished, Here Be Dragons, fantastic!! This is only my second book of Mrs Penmans, I thought nothing would be able to touch The Sunne in Splendour, how wrong could I be?
It’s funny but after reading her books and others, I have to gain as much information about the side characters as well, not just the main players in the book. To me that says something about a book, when it gets you wanting to do further research on the side characters. Not only that, it says something about a book when it gets me to get my wife to drive the last four hours of the car journey so I can carry on reading.
Here Be Dragons is my favourite - although I rate them all highly. Glad you enjoyed it Wealcere. Hope your wife wasn't too tired with all that driving!
Loveday
11-20-2009, 06:45 PM
I know it's been awhile since anyone's posted in this thread, but I'm new, and I just bought The Reckoning yesterday. I had read the first two in the trilogy some years ago, but for some reason never read the third one. Now, after going through this thread, I think I'm going to go back and re-read the others before I start The Reckoning.
I'd better check my stock of tissues before I begin, though. :D
Ayup, that book really killed me; I was a wreck for about a week, couldn't read another thing.
sharon
11-29-2009, 07:16 PM
Imagine how it was for me, Ash. I was seriously in need of grief counseling by the time I finished The Reckoning. Even though there is always a lot of tragedy in my books, I think this one was the saddest, for the losses to Wales would resonate for centuries. Even as late as the 1920's, children in schools in Wales would be punished for speaking Welsh.
I remember you telling me about the grief counseling when you were in town then, and I really had never thought of it before, how a book affects the writer as its written. This is esp the case in this book, because you wanted to be historically accurate. You could have made a jolly good ending and made lots of people happy. But that wasn't what happened. And knowing what was coming later made it even hurt more.
4ever Queen
12-01-2009, 12:42 AM
Personally, after reading Here be Dragons and Falls the Shadow back to back I could not move on to The Reckoning since I needed some respite from all the tears and overwhelming feelings that these two great novels made me feel. :o :o :p This was just last Sept, but I think I am finally ready for it, but not before making sure that I have a full box of tissues next to me. :p I know the Reckoning will come to be another marvelous story that will stay with me forever, but more than that, it’s a very special book already because I got this as a special gift from none other but Sharon herself!! :D :D Sorry all but I really had to boast about this and praise her generosity, I was thrilled when she told me it will be on its way! :p :) :D It’s all autographed and dedicated---it was an awesome birthday gift that I will forever cherish. :)
diamondlil
12-01-2009, 01:06 AM
I would be excited enough to boast too 4ever Queen! Treasure that book!
sharon
12-11-2009, 02:31 PM
On December 11, 1282, the Welsh prince, Llywelyn ap Gruffydd was slain. In a haunting elegy by his court bard, Gruffydd ab yr Ynad Goch, a traditional song of lament became a despairing cry from the heart, giving voice to the anguish of the Welsh, who understood all too well what they'd lost. "Ah, God, that the sea ...would cover the land! What is left us that we should linger?" The Welsh would remember him as Ein Llyw Olaf--Our Last Leader. And he has not been forgotten. Just this year a mountain in Snowdonia was named after Gwenllian, his little daughter, captured by Edward I and confined to a convent, living out her days as a nun at Sempringham Priory in the Lincolnshire Fens.
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